Trespasser and High-End AMD hardware

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Trespasser and High-End AMD hardware

Post by RexHunter99 »

Just for reference while reading:
CPU: AMD FX 8350 8-Core (Piledriver)
GPU: AMD Radeon HD 7750 + AMD Radeon HD 7750 (OC 2GB Edition)
RAM: 8GiB 1600mhz Corsair


I've recently installed Trespasser on my new system to give it a go, found out that it's impossible to play it with dual cards, luckily AMD offer a disable CrossfireX feature for specific application binaries, so I went ahead and put Trespasser's binaries in a profile to disable CrossfireX, game ran like a dream after that (with Crossfire on you get a mostly black screen with a small 32-48 pixel cut of the original screens) I'm hitting nigh on 150 fps in even heavy load areas near dinosaurs, the processor isn't even being utilized (go figure...) would be nice to somehow allow Trespasser to branch out and use at least 6 cores just to see how the physics engine handles.

I tried running the AMD binary ( K6 ) but for some reason trespasser can't see that I have 3DNow! optimisations and fails to run, when my own Processor code can see the extension available (along with all the SSE extensions) But it runs great in P6 Would be a good idea to try it out on my K10 AMD APU A8 just to see if 3DNow! makes a difference at all.
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Re: Trespasser and High-End AMD hardware

Post by machf »

RexHunter99 wrote:found out that it's impossible to play it with dual cards, luckily AMD offer a disable CrossfireX feature for specific application binaries
Maybe it's just an AMD thing, I remember running it on a Core i7 with dual NVidia GTS250s (ECS Hydra) without problems back in 2009...
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Re: Trespasser and High-End AMD hardware

Post by RexHunter99 »

machf wrote:
RexHunter99 wrote:found out that it's impossible to play it with dual cards, luckily AMD offer a disable CrossfireX feature for specific application binaries
Maybe it's just an AMD thing, I remember running it on a Core i7 with dual NVidia GTS250s (ECS Hydra) without problems back in 2009...
SLI and CrossfireX work different, SLI tends to always be via a cable bridge between the cards while CrossfireX is over the motherboard (low-power cards are able to use this like mine) Also remember that I was running the Intel P6 optimised binary, not an AMD optimised binary. If there was such a thing as just a Trespasser binary without optimisations that are processor specific, this likely might not have occured.
What I could do is set the second card as the primary adapter to be used by Trespasser so Trespasser could have it's own GPU separate from the OS rendering, meaning full performance rendering, same as how I could allocate Core W,X,Y,Z to the game and give it a different priority for the CPU.
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Re: Trespasser and High-End AMD hardware

Post by mleise »

RexHunter99 wrote:I tried running the AMD binary ( K6 ) but for some reason trespasser can't see that I have 3DNow! optimisations and fails to run, when my own Processor code can see the extension available (along with all the SSE extensions) But it runs great in P6 Would be a good idea to try it out on my K10 AMD APU A8 just to see if 3DNow! makes a difference at all.
The problem is that the CPU detection code is very conservative. It is in one file, so if you can recompile Trespasser you can simply disable the safeties. On the other hand 3DNow! is being phased out by AMD. Maybe the implementation on modern CPUs is already 2nd class "legacy" support. I had an ATi 8500, the only card with on-die subdivision/tesselation of meshes. It worked great in Half-Life. The next ATi card I bought had only software support for that feature, since it wasn't successful on the market and I had a major FPS loss in Half-Life with it enabled although the gfx card was probably 4 times faster.
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Re: Trespasser and High-End AMD hardware

Post by RexHunter99 »

mleise wrote:
RexHunter99 wrote:I tried running the AMD binary ( K6 ) but for some reason trespasser can't see that I have 3DNow! optimisations and fails to run, when my own Processor code can see the extension available (along with all the SSE extensions) But it runs great in P6 Would be a good idea to try it out on my K10 AMD APU A8 just to see if 3DNow! makes a difference at all.
The problem is that the CPU detection code is very conservative. It is in one file, so if you can recompile Trespasser you can simply disable the safeties. On the other hand 3DNow! is being phased out by AMD. Maybe the implementation on modern CPUs is already 2nd class "legacy" support. I had an ATi 8500, the only card with on-die subdivision/tesselation of meshes. It worked great in Half-Life. The next ATi card I bought had only software support for that feature, since it wasn't successful on the market and I had a major FPS loss in Half-Life with it enabled although the gfx card was probably 4 times faster.
You're missing the point. To check for a processor feature you poll the hardware to give you information back, thus the need for Trespasser to have Processor.dll packaged with it's retail release. I know my processor has 3DNow! optimisations available, but Trespasser's bootstrap code seems to not recognise that. The problem may lie therein within a custom bootstrap that DWI wrote for Trespasser for instance, I've had experience with these before and if you don't work with them properly, they can be a hindrance later on as new architectures come out.
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Re: Trespasser and High-End AMD hardware

Post by machf »

Anyone ever bothered checking up to what AMD processor the K6 executable is able to run?
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Re: Trespasser and High-End AMD hardware

Post by RexHunter99 »

machf wrote:Anyone ever bothered checking up to what AMD processor the K6 executable is able to run?
Any K6 Model processor and theoretically any K# model after that up to K10, the last of which was in the AMD A8 APU series before they moved over to a new design. (Newer A8 processors use a different design, IIRC anything in the A8 series over model 3000 dont use K10 anymore)
This doesn't include Athlon/Phenom btw, they are another design altogether, FX seems to be included in that "cant use it"box.
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Re: Trespasser and High-End AMD hardware

Post by mleise »

Oh sorry, I just looked at the source code again. RexHunter is right, they actually check for AMD K7 or later family. No sign of conservatism indeed. :yes:
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Re: Trespasser and High-End AMD hardware

Post by SylverRaptor »

RexHunter99 wrote:Just for reference while reading:
CPU: AMD FX 8350 8-Core (Piledriver)
GPU: AMD Radeon HD 7750 + AMD Radeon HD 7750 (OC 2GB Edition)
RAM: 8GiB 1600mhz Corsair


I've recently installed Trespasser on my new system to give it a go, found out that it's impossible to play it with dual cards, luckily AMD offer a disable CrossfireX feature for specific application binaries, so I went ahead and put Trespasser's binaries in a profile to disable CrossfireX, game ran like a dream after that (with Crossfire on you get a mostly black screen with a small 32-48 pixel cut of the original screens) I'm hitting nigh on 150 fps in even heavy load areas near dinosaurs, the processor isn't even being utilized (go figure...) would be nice to somehow allow Trespasser to branch out and use at least 6 cores just to see how the physics engine handles.

I tried running the AMD binary ( K6 ) but for some reason trespasser can't see that I have 3DNow! optimisations and fails to run, when my own Processor code can see the extension available (along with all the SSE extensions) But it runs great in P6 Would be a good idea to try it out on my K10 AMD APU A8 just to see if 3DNow! makes a difference at all.
Hey. The only problem is with it, that the newer AMD processors don't have 3d Now! optimizations. At least from what I know from the architectures. I read it somewhere. Don't know where.

Congrats to your configuration. I've go myself an APU instead. 2 modules of Piledriver, and 256 shaders Radeon. :9 And Tres is just works fine. :yum:
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Re: Trespasser and High-End AMD hardware

Post by RexHunter99 »

SylverRaptor wrote:
RexHunter99 wrote:Just for reference while reading:
CPU: AMD FX 8350 8-Core (Piledriver)
GPU: AMD Radeon HD 7750 + AMD Radeon HD 7750 (OC 2GB Edition)
RAM: 8GiB 1600mhz Corsair


I've recently installed Trespasser on my new system to give it a go, found out that it's impossible to play it with dual cards, luckily AMD offer a disable CrossfireX feature for specific application binaries, so I went ahead and put Trespasser's binaries in a profile to disable CrossfireX, game ran like a dream after that (with Crossfire on you get a mostly black screen with a small 32-48 pixel cut of the original screens) I'm hitting nigh on 150 fps in even heavy load areas near dinosaurs, the processor isn't even being utilized (go figure...) would be nice to somehow allow Trespasser to branch out and use at least 6 cores just to see how the physics engine handles.

I tried running the AMD binary ( K6 ) but for some reason trespasser can't see that I have 3DNow! optimisations and fails to run, when my own Processor code can see the extension available (along with all the SSE extensions) But it runs great in P6 Would be a good idea to try it out on my K10 AMD APU A8 just to see if 3DNow! makes a difference at all.
Hey. The only problem is with it, that the newer AMD processors don't have 3d Now! optimizations. At least from what I know from the architectures. I read it somewhere. Don't know where.

Congrats to your configuration. I've go myself an APU instead. 2 modules of Piledriver, and 256 shaders Radeon. :9 And Tres is just works fine. :yum:
Can confirm that the Radeon R9 series runs Trespasser fine :3 I have an R9 280X now, goddamn powerhouse... and sounds like a runaway train haha.
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Re: Trespasser and High-End AMD hardware

Post by SylverRaptor »

RexHunter99 wrote:
SylverRaptor wrote: Hey. The only problem is with it, that the newer AMD processors don't have 3d Now! optimizations. At least from what I know from the architectures. I read it somewhere. Don't know where.

Congrats to your configuration. I've go myself an APU instead. 2 modules of Piledriver, and 256 shaders Radeon. :9 And Tres is just works fine. :yum:
Can confirm that the Radeon R9 series runs Trespasser fine :3 I have an R9 280X now, goddamn powerhouse... and sounds like a runaway train haha.
Great! :mrgreen:
I was wondering... What would happen, if someone rewrite the code of Trespasser, and made it for HSA. Like it could run on the IGP shaders. I don't know if this code would work better on hundreds of threads. But I would love to see it. :D
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Re: Trespasser and High-End AMD hardware

Post by SylverRaptor »

Yeah, I DID remember it right:
Processors supporting 3DNow
Optimized for 3DNow

All AMD processors after K6-2 (inclusive) up to August 2010. Discontinued for future AMD processors.
From K6-2, to AMD Phenom II series, all processors supported. The new Bulldozer architecture doesn't support it. :P
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Re: Trespasser and High-End AMD hardware

Post by rms »

http://developer.amd.com/community/blog ... eprecated/
I'm not sure just when 3DNow was disabled, sounds like it was though!
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Re: Trespasser and High-End AMD hardware

Post by SylverRaptor »

rms wrote:http://developer.amd.com/community/blog ... eprecated/
I'm not sure just when 3DNow was disabled, sounds like it was though!
It wasn't "disabled". They just left it out from the processors. That last AMD CPU that had 3dnow!, was the Phenom 2.
Maybe Ax-3xxx APU's still have it, but from 5xxx all APU's using the newer bulldozer architecture, so they don't have it.
I know, because I have an A8-5600K.
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