Pickup truck in Trespasser - attention car buffs!

[SOCL]

I also posted this on the forums at JPLegacy, but I doubt it'll get the same sort of response there as it might here. So...

So this is perhaps one of the oddest postings I've ever made, but I want to work through something and would appreciate community feedback. Basically, I am trying to find a viable answer to this ridiculous question: what is the make and model of the ubiquitous pickup truck seen throughout Trespasser?

I know it sounds nuts, but I'm writing a Trespasser-related story (you can see here, called "The Factory Floor" after Hammond's line describing Sorna in The Lost World film -- this is, I swear to God, not a plug) and real-world authenticity matters to me. I've managed to get the contenders down to two makes/models. Give me your opinion: do you think it's a:
(1) Chevrolet S-10
(2) Dodge Dakota


Chevy S-10 (Wikipedia article)
Pros: The year match when Sorna being "built" (first production of S-10's was in 1982) and just about every part of the body fits the Trespasser pickup, particularly the build and the grill. It also carries the added advantage of being available earlier than the Dodge Dakota. The S-10 was also available in a 4x4 package in 1984. Finally, the Chevy brand is perfect because it fits with a large number of vehicles seen on Sorna in The Lost World film, namely a Chevy Suburban and a Chevy Blazer, not to mention the GMC truck Eric stays in and a second Chevy Suburban. This makes sense since we would expect that InGen would have cut a deal with an auto manufacturer for their utility vehicles the same way they did with their tour vehicles.
Cons: The headlights don't match. Look at the comparison shot below and you'll see that where the Trespasser pickup has split headlights on the front and also on the side, the S-10 only has the side parts and not the split sections.


Dodge Dakota (Wikipedia article)
Pros: The years are basically correct, though it would mean a later introduction of the pickups (the first Dakotas rolled off the assembly line in 1987), which is not a problem in itself. The headlights are perfect.
Cons: The grill is simply wrong, though this can be glossed over. Though not technically a con, the Dakota's 4x4 trim was only available if you got a V6, which doesn't make as much business sense as sticking to a 4x4 with a 4-cylinder (cost of gas and importing said gas to Sorna). The Dakota also doesn't have the added benefit of being a "business deal" like the Chevrolets since we don't see any other Dodges on Sorna. (see the IMCDb articles for The Lost World and Jurassic Park III)



Other contenders that I have already ruled out include the Ford Ranger (mostly because the only model that fits the physical bill first rolled off the line in 1989, though I suspect the Ranger was the prototype used by the game's designers), the Jeep Comanche (physically does not match), and the Toyota Hilux (physically does not match).


So, what do you think? Is it the Dakota, or is it the S-10? Or is it something else entirely? Have I perhaps missed a contender? If so, please let me know -- and give me some details!

[machf]

Hmmm... didn't someone start a similar topic some time ago? I think I remember even seeing pictures...

[SOCL]

Damn, that would be embarrassing...

I found [url=viewtopic.php?f=118&t=5625&hilit=pickup]this thread[/i], but it identifies the pickups as Chevy C/K's, but I'm not even close to convinced. The trucks are simply too small to be C/K's, not to mention the body isn't a match.

Otherwise, I did a search and either missed it or can't find it.

[machf]

No, that's not the one I was thinking of. And I don't think the trucks were identified, it was very simiilar to what you posted, an attempt to match trucks from that period to the ones in the game.

EDIT: I think it was probably this one:
viewtopic.php?p=103967#p103967

EDIT 2: or maybe this other one:
viewtopic.php?p=103727#p103727

[SOCL]

Interesting. The headlights certainly work, but I don't think the proportions are quite right. The pickups in the game are rather small, while C/K's are actually quite large trucks, requiring one to "step up" into it. Even considering the removal of the tires, the trucks in Trespasser simply don't seem tall enough to be C/K's. I'll admit, though, the alternatives aren't entirely satisfactory either...

[RexHunter99]

I don't want to come off as an ass, but just remember that Trespasser is a video game and not everything is to scale in the game-world as it is in the real world, many of the vehicles are too small, some too large, some structures are oddly shaped, this was to accomodate the player physics and such.

[SOCL]

I don't want to come off as an ass, but just remember that Trespasser is a video game and not everything is to scale in the game-world as it is in the real world, many of the vehicles are too small, some too large, some structures are oddly shaped, this was to accomodate the player physics and such.

I totally get that. In fact, I'm fairly certain the trucks are supposed to be Ford Rangers, bu they don't fit into what I need for my story. I completely understand that what I'm doing is almost completely arbitrary. All I'm looking for, though, are opinions and feedback from the community on what they think it is if we approached the matter as if Trespasser were a real-world event/series of events. In the end, it really doesn't matter. Think of it as just an exercise in thought.

[tatu]

Since all of the copyright crap the team wouldn't be able to model any IRL car I believe. I would guess they just made a pickup that was looking like a regular one TBH.

[SOCL]

Since all of the copyright crap the team wouldn't be able to model any IRL car I believe. I would guess they just made a pickup that was looking like a regular one TBH.

Right. I totally follow that, and I totally agree.

I think the point of why I posted this here is being missed. I'm not trying to figure out what pickup truck the modelers had in mind -- that's a useless, pedantic effort. I am trying to see what the community thinks, namely what make/model of pickup truck does the community think most appears to be the one in Trespasser.

There's, obviously, no right or wrong answer. I just thought it would be fun to debate it. I seem to think that it's the Chevy S10, but after seeing a Ford Ranger yesterday without the "Ford" logo in the center of the grille, I'm more and more convinced the model they used was probably the Ranger (though it came out too late to "fit" into the Trespasser world). The Chevy C/K is also a nice option, but given the size of the white pickups to the InGen safari/hunter Jeeps and the Unimogs (which I'm using as a reference of scale), I think the white pickups are too small to be C/K's.

I'm merely interested to know what others think. I am well aware that the "real" identity of the truck's make and model will never be known.

[hppav]

Trespasser's Truck was modeled in a scale where the top of the truck was up at Anne's knee so the size in game wasn't up to the person who modeled it, but rather who scaled it up and placed it in the level. Even then it's inconsistent between levels (Example the Beach has 2.7630 as the scale whereas the Town has 2.5059) So to determine what they had in mind do not use in game scale for reference, rather just use the body styling. The styling is most consistent with early 90s GM trucks, Chevy and GMC specifically. Look at the line going down the side of the truck, it's not like that on the Ford or Dodge, that line lies much lower on those trucks - close to the bottom of the sides.

I went with the Chevy 1500 because it made more sense for the purpose the truck was employed, lots of hauling through jungle. And it also matched the body panels and headlights a lot better than the other option, which was the S10. But for all I know it could be a GMC Sierra 1500... GMC would make more sense due to it being GM's commercial business division.

Either way I'm fairly certain it's a GM.

[SOCL]

Trespasser's Truck was modeled in a scale where the top of the truck was up at Anne's knee so the size in game wasn't up to the person who modeled it, but rather who scaled it up and placed it in the level. Even then it's inconsistent between levels (Example the Beach has 2.7630 as the scale whereas the Town has 2.5059) So to determine what they had in mind do not use in game scale for reference, rather just use the body styling. The styling is most consistent with early 90s GM trucks, Chevy and GMC specifically. Look at the line going down the side of the truck, it's not like that on the Ford or Dodge, that line lies much lower on those trucks - close to the bottom of the sides.

I went with the Chevy 1500 because it made more sense for the purpose the truck was employed, lots of hauling through jungle. And it also matched the body panels and headlights a lot better than the other option, which was the S10. But for all I know it could be a GMC Sierra 1500... GMC would make more sense due to it being GM's commercial business division.

Either way I'm fairly certain it's a GM.

And this is why I wanted to have this discussion! I didn't realize that the scale changes based on the context/level -- how very interesting! The only problem I have with the 1500 series (same as the C/K) is that the generation that takes up most of the 80s doesn't look like the truck. This assumes that InGen imported the fourth generation of the C/K in its very first year of production, which seems difficult at best. It would be worth checking which years had the correct front headlights to see what exactly we're dealing with. Anything after 1989 would be too "modern" for our purposes since we have a terminus ante quem of late 1989 according to Hammond's voice-overs/memoir.

[hppav]

Actually April 1987 is when the C/K's 1988 model year was introduced, and August 27, 1989 is when Jurassic Park happens in the Trespasser universe (Hammond's VO VH138) . That's about 2.25 years. In the game Hammond was going to let scientists and businessmen visit the island after the park opened, which would be in 1990 so it's entirely possible that he bought new trucks to make it seem as if he "spared no expense" at the research facility as well...

Of course that's assuming that the team worried about model years and didn't just pick a truck that was owned by a team member or that was readily available in 1995-1996 when they started working on Trespasser.

[RexHunter99]

I refer to Bioshock Infinite's tie ins to Bioshock 1, the script writers rarely set shit up like that, it just miraculously happens. IIRC they were saying that songbird's dying screams heard in Bioshock 1 were just some generic effect that when they went back and heard, really easily tied into the Infinite story, thus players now hear the cry in Bioshock 1 and hear Songbird dying as opposed to some creepy audio effect.

I don't remember if Spielberg gave the Tres dev's access to the TLW materials but to me the trucks look like one of the abandoned trucks in the ops center area of TLW, could be they saw those trucks themselves and just modeled as closely as possible, like someone said earlier, copyright was a royal bitch in this game, some stuff was cut purely because copyright holders were anal.

[SOCL]

I'm actually pretty sure that the developers created anachronistic truck models based on what they saw around them in their day-to-day lives. I just assumed S10 (or another small truck) because the U.S. military, particularly the U.S. Navy, would purchase small SUVs for its day-to-day utility work, saving larger vehicles for maintenance teams. So, for example, on the Navy base where I grew up, Little Creek Amphibious Base in Norfolk, Virginia, the U.S. Navy civilian employees drove around in white Jeep Cherokees, a small number of Jeep Comanches, and Ford F-150s (keep in mind they were smaller back then than they are today). Their heavy-duty vehicles were flatbed versions of the F-350 and their cargo van equivalent (E-350). The idea was to save money and gas. I just applied this to the InGen model on Sorna as I saw it in Trespasser.

That said, the arguments in favor of the Chevy C/K are very, very compelling, and I am more and more convinced that they fit the bill the more I think about. The argument regarding the design of the body (as hppav pointed out) compelling reaches the same conclusion I reached, namely that the trucks are GM, either Chevrolet or GMC. Additionally, hppav also provided some important information in this thread, quoted herein:

I think it's a late 80s, early 90s Chevy Silverado 1500.

They came with headlights in both configurations:

Trepasser's -


And CryEngine 3's -

Hppav, is there a video or an image missing there that's relevant?

Finally, hppav has pointed out the fact that the fourth generation C/K's came out in 1987 makes them fit in well. It actually fits my theory that, in the Trespasser world, Sorna was not evacuated until sometime after the incident at Jurassic Park in 1989, so possibly even early 1990. I use Hammond's line about dropping the mug, the workers walking off the job when they found out he was bankrupt, and the evacuation of Sorna. Unless we theorize that they evacuated from Nublar to Sorna in the Trespasser canon of events, the only conclusion is that following the incident on Nublar, Hammond went to Sorna to try to shore up the situation, but was then forced into bankruptcy and the island was subsequently abandoned.

So we're thinking that the truck on the left is the correct one, a 1988 Chevy C/K1500?

Spoiler: show

Hppav, you specifically mentioned the Silverado and the Sierra. Can you give the details on why you prefer one to the other? I'm curious.



A little off topic, but I have a comment regarding something odd in the Trespasser timeline: Hammond cites that in 1997 the InGen Board of Directors took the company from him, just like in The Lost World film. Fine, fine, but wait, wasn't InGen bankrupt? Are we to assume that the company reorganized and kept Hammond as its CEO? That seems odd, doesn't it? I mean, most companies that go through Chapter 11 reorganization rarely keep their Board of Directors, much less their CEO. The answer could be (1) the company went through Chapter 11 and Hammond survived or (2) the company didn't go bankrupt until after the incident in San Diego in 1997.

Well, option 2 is out because the newspaper showing InGen filing for Chapter 11 gives a date in 1989 (October, I believe). So clearly the comment regarding workers walking off the job dates to just after or around this time. So is it 1? I have a hard time buying it, but I don't know what else to say. Did the investors and Federal government really think they could trust Hammond a second time around from 1989 to 1997? It's odd, really...

[RexHunter99]

I'm actually pretty sure that the developers created anachronistic truck models based on what they saw around them in their day-to-day lives. I just assumed S10 (or another small truck) because the U.S. military, particularly the U.S. Navy, would purchase small SUVs for its day-to-day utility work, saving larger vehicles for maintenance teams. So, for example, on the Navy base where I grew up, Little Creek Amphibious Base in Norfolk, Virginia, the U.S. Navy civilian employees drove around in white Jeep Cherokees, a small number of Jeep Comanches, and Ford F-150s (keep in mind they were smaller back then than they are today). Their heavy-duty vehicles were flatbed versions of the F-350 and their cargo van equivalent (E-350). The idea was to save money and gas. I just applied this to the InGen model on Sorna as I saw it in Trespasser.

That said, the arguments in favor of the Chevy C/K are very, very compelling, and I am more and more convinced that they fit the bill the more I think about. The argument regarding the design of the body (as hppav pointed out) compelling reaches the same conclusion I reached, namely that the trucks are GM, either Chevrolet or GMC. Additionally, hppav also provided some important information in this thread, quoted herein:

I think it's a late 80s, early 90s Chevy Silverado 1500.

They came with headlights in both configurations:

Trepasser's -


And CryEngine 3's -

Hppav, is there a video or an image missing there that's relevant?

Finally, hppav has pointed out the fact that the fourth generation C/K's came out in 1987 makes them fit in well. It actually fits my theory that, in the Trespasser world, Sorna was not evacuated until sometime after the incident at Jurassic Park in 1989, so possibly even early 1990. I use Hammond's line about dropping the mug, the workers walking off the job when they found out he was bankrupt, and the evacuation of Sorna. Unless we theorize that they evacuated from Nublar to Sorna in the Trespasser canon of events, the only conclusion is that following the incident on Nublar, Hammond went to Sorna to try to shore up the situation, but was then forced into bankruptcy and the island was subsequently abandoned.

So we're thinking that the truck on the left is the correct one, a 1988 Chevy C/K1500?

Spoiler: show

Hppav, you specifically mentioned the Silverado and the Sierra. Can you give the details on why you prefer one to the other? I'm curious.



A little off topic, but I have a comment regarding something odd in the Trespasser timeline: Hammond cites that in 1997 the InGen Board of Directors took the company from him, just like in The Lost World film. Fine, fine, but wait, wasn't InGen bankrupt? Are we to assume that the company reorganized and kept Hammond as its CEO? That seems odd, doesn't it? I mean, most companies that go through Chapter 11 reorganization rarely keep their Board of Directors, much less their CEO. The answer could be (1) the company went through Chapter 11 and Hammond survived or (2) the company didn't go bankrupt until after the incident in San Diego in 1997.

Well, option 2 is out because the newspaper showing InGen filing for Chapter 11 gives a date in 1989 (October, I believe). So clearly the comment regarding workers walking off the job dates to just after or around this time. So is it 1? I have a hard time buying it, but I don't know what else to say. Did the investors and Federal government really think they could trust Hammond a second time around from 1989 to 1997? It's odd, really...

The problem with Trespasser is it slots in between the novel and the movie events.

In the movie InGen had been badly hurt (financially) by the failure of Jurassic Park, with all that money wasted they wanted to recoup, thus the expedition to Sorna to capture their specimens for use in a theme park on the mainland, a much cheaper affair and more tightly controllable. They ousted Hammond due to his decline in health and using claims he was incapable of tending to the day-to-day function of the company and put Ludlow in charge as CEO stand-in.

In the game Jurassic Park was shut down and possibly destroyed (mentioned but unconfirmed in both the novels and movies) InGen abandoned the island entirely and left it to its own devices, Sorna most likely continued to function more as a research and development facility, possibly so InGen could attempt to recoup their losses, sell off their patents, genetic maps and the whole set-up for other uses, but it seems that something occured on Sorna, be it the dinosaurs became uncontrollable (I remember there being need for a lot of guns to defend the town during the evacuation), or some sort of storm or a combination of both.

Also wasn't Muldoon head of security on both Nublar and Sorna? I recall that he was at Sorna during some event which could concrete in a proper timeline or destroy the existing one.