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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 12:37 am 
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Brachiosaurus
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Draconisaurus wrote:
Basically I didn't see that the mouth texture was already there and just made a new one. That box import method was the best one that I can think of; I believe your only alternative is to import the whole raptor, erasing the bump (normal) maps.
However, you can use Trespasser CE to add custom bumpmaps. Ask machf or TheIdiot on how to do that, it's not a method I employ.

I agree that I think GeomAdd is just adding new textures. I have been trying many different ways. It never seems to warn me there are textures already there. Nor does it ask if its ok to overwrite them.

I do have a backup of the level for each major change/update. Even so, I think I will leave them as rainbow mouth for now. This is because the import will destroy the bumps. If I import the dinos now. Any other changes I do to the level will have to be redone from the import point if a proper fix is found. Perhaps that SWPadd tool is an option. I have never used it though.

As far as CE goes for adding custom bumps back in. I dont think that will work with Pine Valley. CE seems to keep the main puzzle from completing. Thus requiring that we play it from ATX or the nasty old original EXE.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 2:33 am 
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Brachiosaurus
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A little update about the ambient Electrical sound around the power grid. It is indeed triggered. There are actually two triggered sounds. I was able to get the first working by editing the script.

string FireExpression = "TrigLeftSwitchDown-00 | TrigRightSwitchDown-00"

There should be an "&" instead of the vertical bar between the two triggers. I learned this by examining other dual trigger scripts in the level.

As for the other sound. I cant get that one working. I have no idea whats wrong with it. There is a trigger that fires to turn on the status light in the control room. That one works. The second sound is scripted to fire when that trigger fires but... Nothing seems to happen.

It seems the sound triggers are a but unresponsive. Especially the electrical sounds. Sometimes it takes many tries entering the trigger to make the sound fire off. Maybe because there are so many overlapping triggers in the Geothermal plant all fighting for dominance?


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 3:34 am 
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T-Rex Killer
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LCountach wrote:
A little update about the ambient Electrical sound around the power grid. It is indeed triggered. There are actually two triggered sounds. I was able to get the first working by editing the script.

string FireExpression = "TrigLeftSwitchDown-00 | TrigRightSwitchDown-00"

There should be an "&" instead of the vertical bar between the two triggers. I learned this by examining other dual trigger scripts in the level.

The "|" symbol is a logic "OR", and the "&" is a logic "AND". What you've done is change the condition from verifying that *any* of those two triggers having fired to *both* having fired.
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As for the other sound. I cant get that one working. I have no idea whats wrong with it. There is a trigger that fires to turn on the status light in the control room. That one works. The second sound is scripted to fire when that trigger fires but... Nothing seems to happen.

It seems the sound triggers are a but unresponsive. Especially the electrical sounds. Sometimes it takes many tries entering the trigger to make the sound fire off. Maybe because there are so many overlapping triggers in the Geothermal plant all fighting for dominance?

I have to look at those triggers when I get some free time...

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 4:02 am 
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Brachiosaurus
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machf wrote:
The "|" symbol is a logic "OR", and the "&" is a logic "AND". What you've done is change the condition from verifying that *any* of those two triggers having fired to *both* having fired.

Interesting. That is something I did not know but it makes since. Strange how I never heard the sound until that change made the trigger require both and not one or the other. Trespasser, she is a strange beast.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 6:34 am 
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LCountach wrote:
As far as CE goes for adding custom bumps back in. I dont think that will work with Pine Valley. CE seems to keep the main puzzle from completing. Thus requiring that we play it from ATX or the nasty old original EXE.


If you're not going with a CE version for this and go for ATX or the original you could just ignore bumpmaps all together. Bumpmaps only works in Software mode and not in Hardware mode where most people probably use today anyway.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 7:44 am 
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Actually, even in hardware mode, any bumpmapped textures are rendered in software mode...

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Tres WIP: updated T-Script Reference and File Formats documents
Sound name listings for the Demo (build 117), Retail (build 116), Beta 103, Beta 99, Beta 97, Beta 96, Build 55, PC Gamer Alpha (build 32) and E3 1998 Alpha (build 22) TPA files


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 9:10 am 
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machf wrote:
Actually, even in hardware mode, any bumpmapped textures are rendered in software mode...


Oh I see. Tho I remember doing some tests years ago on one of the objects and the bumpmaps shows way better in software mode.
Then I think it is still worth it to learn how CE works with them for now and get a CE workaround with the GeoPlant puzzle. AFAIK Lee never actually "fixed" any script or changed how they worked if they were used and would change the behavior of it. For one in IJ (that is broken of how it should've worked) he made an external script to use instead if you wanted it to work as indented.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 2:15 pm 
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Brachiosaurus
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tatu wrote:
If you're not going with a CE version for this and go for ATX or the original you could just ignore bumpmaps all together. Bumpmaps only works in Software mode and not in Hardware mode where most people probably use today anyway.

I dont know if it is the same for others but, I can't actually play and enjoy the game in hardware mode with ATX or original at my monitors native resolution of 1080p. The FPS swings wildly from over 30fps down to less than 1fps. I actually had to walk backwards down Pine Valleys hill to the first raptor to test bumpmaping. (hardware mode where its most obvious) Facing forward is 1fps all the way down and the horizon is glitched out. In software I can maintain 20~30fps at all times. Much more enjoyable. I also prefer the software rendered look. When I play with CE. I have configured it to look like software rendered mode.

The rest of the levels can be played in CE and is my preferred way. I am unfortunately going to have to put in the notes something about the main puzzle not completing in Pine Valley with CE. If you cant complete the puzzle. You cant leave the level because the electronic drawbridges at the end wont activate.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 4:37 pm 
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Brachiosaurus
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tatu wrote:
Then I think it is still worth it to learn how CE works with them for now and get a CE workaround with the GeoPlant puzzle.

That would be great. Unfortunately, I am not knowledgeable enough with scripting to do that. Perhaps someone here at TresCom can help out?

I would also like to know why the Steam Turbine portion of the puzzle auto completes in ATX, CE, and Original 1.1. I am almost sure in the past I needed to do something with the levers to make it work. I have been looking at it in TresEd. It seems the puzzle wants the player to get the needle of the gauge on the far left to move into the green portion of the gauge.

I still need to play through PV with the Build 96 EXE to see if the Steam Turbine portion of the puzzle works there.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 9:36 pm 
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I just did another playthrough of Pine Valley in build 96. This time with the original EXE. Last time was with a fresh install of build 96 but with the ATX EXE. With the original build 96 EXE, the steam turbine puzzle does not autocomplete or even function. Something about CE, ATX, and Original 1.1 handles the steam turbine puzzle differently. I am not sure how that helps solve any problems but it is information I could only guess at before.

Ohh and the electric draw bridges sort of functioned. They didnt require the main puzzle to be solved. They started in the down position instead of up. There was no sound. And the control panels were very high off the ground. But... they did move. Strange, I dont remember them moving before. Of course that was back in 2013. Memory is a unreliable thing.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 10:04 pm 
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Brachiosaurus
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I think I found the problem with ambient electrical sound. The way it is placed already has the player standing inside the trigger when the switches are thrown. Because of this, the player must walk away from the power grid and re-enter the trigger for the sound to function. I solved the issue by resizing the trigger bubble just enough so the player is standing outside when throwing the switches. That way when they approach the grid to hit the buttons after the switches. The sound is triggered and plays as it should.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 10:34 pm 
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T-Rex Killer
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Or you could change the condition from a PlayerEnterTrigger one to a PlayerInTrigger one...

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Tres WIP: updated T-Script Reference and File Formats documents
Sound name listings for the Demo (build 117), Retail (build 116), Beta 103, Beta 99, Beta 97, Beta 96, Build 55, PC Gamer Alpha (build 32) and E3 1998 Alpha (build 22) TPA files


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 11:59 pm 
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Brachiosaurus
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machf wrote:
Or you could change the condition from a PlayerEnterTrigger one to a PlayerInTrigger one...

Great tip! I again had no idea that was a thing. I really dont know much about scripting. Unfortunately... That caused Trespasser to play the first 1/2 second of the sound clip and get stuck in an endless loop. The complete sound wouldn't play and the sound didn't attenuate with distance. It just blasted max volume no matter how far I walked until I quit the game. I tried again and the same thing happened. Bummer.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 1:07 am 
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Take a look at the T-Script Reference... you can find the link in my signature.

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Visit The Carnivores Saga - a forum devoted to modding Action Forms' Carnivores, Carnivores 2 and Carnivores: Ice Age games
Tres WIP: updated T-Script Reference and File Formats documents
Sound name listings for the Demo (build 117), Retail (build 116), Beta 103, Beta 99, Beta 97, Beta 96, Build 55, PC Gamer Alpha (build 32) and E3 1998 Alpha (build 22) TPA files


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 2:06 am 
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Brachiosaurus
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machf wrote:
Take a look at the T-Script Reference... you can find the link in my signature.

Wow... that is a lot of information! Coding really takes a special kind of mind.


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